Whitepaper review

Here we will post all original accusations and arguments people who hate onecoin wrote all over blogs and comments. We will deeply analyze, dissect and answer everything with objective arguments. People will be left to decide which arguments are more logical and true to them
Bora
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2018 1:29 pm

Whitepaper review

Post by Bora » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:02 pm

Hello , today i read one post on facebook related to the whitepaper (which sounds scary to me) and i would like to share it with you and if is possible someone qualified to review it and share his/hers opinion with us .

This is the post :

OneCoin has released a 2nd attempt of a whitepaper today, click link below to view it 🙈 👇

https://onecoinico.io/WhitePaper-ofc.pdf

Quote below has been taken from another group Re Onecoin so called 'whitepaper' 👇

This “whitepaper” absolutely describes zero of the technical aspects of the alledged blockchain. Just a lot of the old promotion talk and a lot of disclaimers that nothing is their fault if things go south.

And again their claim of making constant back-ups. 🙈 Apparently this never happened during the raid in january. Even though Igor claims that is the reason for all the delays.

Just… Laughable.

The whitepaper is basically extended T&C document made by mixing from several sources in a way that doesn’t make much sense.

E.g. it talks about market risks etc but in legal print it clearly states that ” This Whitepaper does not constitute a prospectus or offer document of any sort and is not intended to constitute an offer of securities or a solicitation for investment in securities in any jurisdiction”.

Lets take an example from the very few technical aspects of the paper. The following statement simply isn’t true for OneCoin, you cannot explore the transactions in blockchain:

(Cont.)

And in fact, the statement above partially is copy-pasted from the OLD Marcelo Garcia White Paper (which described on general level a theoretical upcomping centralized blockchain solution which was never implemented by OneCoin) but contradicts it because it, more sensibly, recommends “anchoring” to the “system of higher trust”(meaning real blockchain like Bitcoin or Ethereum) specifically because the central company could easily tamper the ledgers:

*"The blockchain systems resemble tamper-proof ledgers of transactions, guaranteed by the merkle tree roots attached to each block of transactions.*

In this regard the OneCoin system provides the opportunity to users to access the digital ledger with all the blocks and transactions in it."

Spotted at least one other copy-pastes from the old White paper (the “AWS 2xlarge instance” section. And one other technical text snippet is heavily borrowed from Bitcoin white paper.

In addition, there is an oddity, the mysterious SILO which, I think, refers to the old SILO Capital Group company which was supposed to handle the previous “offering”. I guess they forgot to paste the new shell company’s name 🤔

*"Blockchain systems are tamper-proof ledgers of transactions, and this is essentially guaranteed by the merkle tree roots attached to each block of transactions.*

In a centralised blockchain system, one could argue that the operating entity could simply re-write every single block if they wanted to modify any past transactions. However, this can be easily remediated by anchoring the private blockchain system into another system of higher trust.

This could be a trusted and well-known public blockchain network, or simply a transactional and irreversible information system owned and operated by another reputable counterparty (e.g. a form of git log)."

*"Prospective purchasers of OFC (as referred to in this Whitepaper) should carefully consider and evaluate all risks and uncertainties associated with SILO and/or any other…"

*RE: CoinSafe*

Many members *CoinSafe* 'coins' are still missing since as far back as May *6 months ago!!!

If Onecoin actually had a blockchain (it doesn't) and if user Identities were linked to their coins, than this would be an INSTANT FIX under a centralized system.

*Hunch* is that Onecoin never even backed up their MYSQL servers, and when international Authorities executed a *2-day RAID* on Onecoin HQ January and seized servers, Onecoin permanently lost that data.

So, IMO, for a person who lost, say 1,000 coins (fake, but for the sake of argument) in *CoinSafe*, the company knows not whether they lost 100 or 10,000 because their incompetent scamming asses never backed up the data!

*And THIS is the big Catch-22 and the reason why the company has LOST coins, when they marketed that "unlike bitcoin, in Onecoin which is centralized, it's IMPOSSIBLE to lose coins."*

Igorkrnic
Site Admin
Posts: 1732
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:47 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Igorkrnic » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:16 pm

Bora wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:02 pm
Hello , today i read one post on facebook related to the whitepaper (which sounds scary to me) and i would like to share it with you and if is possible someone qualified to review it and share his/hers opinion with us .
What exactly are you worried about? Sorry but so far into this project, those are "polite" ways to share hater stupidity on this forum since they are banned. Please send your username to my PM so I can check you have onecoins and prove you are not a hater in disguise.

flatrate
Posts: 418
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 9:42 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by flatrate » Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:22 pm

yes, username or to the curb.. good idea !

seems like a copy/paste straight jacket tim tayshony move to me. :lol: :lol:

MLMgenius
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:22 am

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by MLMgenius » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:03 pm

From the whitepaper, page 15:

Participants register for the Offering on www.onecoinico.io by either clicking on
“Participate” to start the registration process. Depending on the choice of participating as a
company or an individual, participants will be asked to submit the relevant KYC/KYB
information.

THERE IS NO PARTICIPATE BUTTON, we cant even start the registration process

Igor, any explanation for this?

Igorkrnic
Site Admin
Posts: 1732
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:47 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Igorkrnic » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:13 pm

MLMgenius wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:03 pm
From the whitepaper, page 15:

Participants register for the Offering on www.onecoinico.io by either clicking on
“Participate” to start the registration process. Depending on the choice of participating as a
company or an individual, participants will be asked to submit the relevant KYC/KYB
information.

THERE IS NO PARTICIPATE BUTTON, we cant even start the registration process

Igor, any explanation for this?
It is obviously not ready yet. The whole sales system, I heard they will now start advertising this on the internet. Probably then, they will add Participate too. It all is kinda off the schedule but then again, it's not like possible investors are going anywhere :)

Igorkrnic
Site Admin
Posts: 1732
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:47 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Igorkrnic » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:41 pm

flatrate wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 9:22 pm
yes, username or to the curb.. good idea !

seems like a copy/paste straight jacket tim tayshony move to me. :lol: :lol:
He seems fine, sent me usernames, will check tomorrow :)

Igorkrnic
Site Admin
Posts: 1732
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 7:47 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Igorkrnic » Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:54 pm

I was in the nature hiking today, so I just read the damn whitepaper.
Without further a due, I will address those comments by people who will not even invest so their opinion should not even matter but hey, seems like our dear network is still uneducated and easily scared by the stupidity of fanatic nolifers...

Let me start this post by writing my short summary of what I saw in the whitepaper.
There is one part of paragraph that says:
Whitepaper wrote:Its sole purpose is to provide relevant and reasonable information to potential purchasers
for them to determine whether to undertake a thorough analysis of the ONE, OFCs and the
ONE Ecosystem with the intent of purchasing OFCs offered.
So, it is clear, not ALL is written here, just like NO whitepaper out there describes ALL. This one is intended to make reader (possible investor) make his mind if this project makes sense, is yes, he will ask more questions, if not, he will close it and go away. Simple as that. So I see no point reading what people who will definitelly not invest have to say about it. Especially haters who mostly do not even properly understand things that they write about.

What I saw in the whitepaper is:
1) Some quotes of IMF director that basically said "crypto is here to stay we need to regulate it".
2) They sure did touch on the current crypto price problems that make retailers impossible to adopt them.
3) They also touched on tech scalability issues that makes cryptos impossible to mass adopt.
4) They definitely touched on the anonymity of other cryptos and that is the final drop that makes governments totally unsure how to regulate them cause they just get rid of the "Swiss bank accounts" and anonymous cryptos are even worse, after all their benefits.
5) Then they politely explain how Onecoin actually solves all those obstacles with their approach.
6) They even put out some tech info, just enough for non IT people that most people are, no need to put algos and charts that few will even read (IMO) cause they will not like this closed centralized model in the first place. Luckilly there are other open source decentralized project (as untrue that is).
7) And for the end, they for sure did make a bunch of legal disclaimers but then again, I read countless whitepapers, that is so normal. Only idiots would not out those.

Now let me touch on those hater comments:

Hater wrote:This “whitepaper” absolutely describes zero of the technical aspects of the alledged blockchain. Just a lot of the old promotion talk and a lot of disclaimers that nothing is their fault if things go south.
First of all, ONE and its ecosystem is not tech project, they are not making some world computer platform based on the blockchain or something and are not looking for high tech geeks to join. They are simply trying to make payment system that is easy to use for retailers and consumers that do not have high tech IT knowledge. Blockchain tech is simply a tool to help keep transactions immutable and secure. Nothing else, it is over-hyped, projects are using it where it is not even needed just to raise some funds, but in reality, and we will see it in coming years, blockchain is just a piece of the puzzle bellow larger ecosystem.

And it is not true there are no tech details, there are and those are well outlined, and again, relatively easy written for common folks to understand, end users of ONE ecosystem are not those whom they need to show algorithms and draw charts in the whitepaper, sorry.

Hater wrote:And again their claim of making constant back-ups. 🙈 Apparently this never happened during the raid in january. Even though Igor claims that is the reason for all the delays.
Just… Laughable.
Always glad to amuse. Delays came because police scared off old IT that made blockchain, backend and front end. All the bugs are because of their poor work. If there are some expert people inside hater camp, then they know how hard (but not impossible) is to find bugs on someone else's code. Since January, no coin from actual wallet accounts are missing, no one got stolen or lost coins. Those that are "missing" are those from maturing coinsafe and those are not even missing, just moved to different address than users Onecoin wallet coin account. That will be fixed after the split and no one will remember this. So not sure what the writer of this argument even though especially cause he said "apparently" - what is apparent please other than your illusions.
Hater wrote:The whitepaper is basically extended T&C document made by mixing from several sources in a way that doesn’t make much sense.
Did he even read any other whitepaper? What about EOS whitepaper? FULL of legal disclaimers and yet who cares?
If this comment author made his own project and whitepaper I am "sure" he would be confident enough with the uncertainty of the regulations not to put any disclaimers that indeed look like T&C...

Hater wrote:E.g. it talks about market risks etc but in legal print, it clearly states that ” This Whitepaper does not constitute a prospectus or offer document of any sort and is not intended to constitute an offer of securities or a solicitation for investment in securities in any jurisdiction”.
If something would not make sense to me, that might mean I did not understand it, that means I am not cleaver enough. I would not brag about it, I would rather try to learn where I was wrong. As I said, and it is the common ico practice since there are no strict regulations yet, there are legal disclaimers like the sentence mentioned in the comment, but Risks are written generally for the risk of participating in the crypto market, and they are very true and real, and seems like OFC will not be saved from some of those risk as ONE will (volatility e.g.).
So commentator compares two totally different things that confuse him.

Hater wrote:Lets take an example from the very few technical aspects of the paper. The following statement simply isn’t true for OneCoin, you cannot explore the transactions in blockchain:
I could not find in the whitepaper where they wrote you can find transactions in the blockchain so another spinoff... As we know, you can see your own transactions (as it should be) and being transparent does not mean you can see every tx on the chain, it means there are no anonymous transactions. This argument feels like arguing with kids on the kindergarten already. Although I did always say I hate not having damn explorer.
Hater wrote:And in fact, the statement above partially is copy-pasted from the OLD Marcelo Garcia White Paper (which described on general level a theoretical upcomping centralized blockchain solution which was never implemented by OneCoin) but contradicts it because it, more sensibly, recommends “anchoring” to the “system of higher trust”(meaning real blockchain like Bitcoin or Ethereum) specifically because the central company could easily tamper the ledgers:

*"The blockchain systems resemble tamper-proof ledgers of transactions, guaranteed by the merkle tree roots attached to each block of transactions.*

In this regard the OneCoin system provides the opportunity to users to access the digital ledger with all the blocks and transactions in it."

Spotted at least one other copy-pastes from the old White paper (the “AWS 2xlarge instance” section. And one other technical text snippet is heavily borrowed from Bitcoin white paper.
First of all, DX Markets did make some audit of the current Onecoin system, not the blockchain, but the system, and he did make some recommendations but those are poorly written in his whitepaper anyway and, courtesy of haters and lack of Marcelo's experience to handle that pressure, he was rejected. That does not matter anymore, point is, that under ex CEO Pierre Arens, I suppose the company had paid DX Markets to write this for them so it is their property and also being true, I see no problem for using those parts here.

Also, if they are using POW, SHA256 and of course, merkle tree and roots which were pioneered in the bitcoin tech, I see nothing odd that explanations of those will look similar or even the same as in bitcoin whitepaper. But I did try to match those tech paragraphs (and several words) from Onecoin whitepaper with Bitcoin whitepaper and could not find matches so seems like this is one more twisted FUD to scare uneducated people cause they know no one will check their crap.

Critique wrote:In addition, there is an oddity, the mysterious SILO which, I think, refers to the old SILO Capital Group company which was supposed to handle the previous “offering”. I guess they forgot to paste the new shell company’s name 🤔
Finally a good one. That indeed seems to be a mistake and I have reported it and I thank to this person.
But, this shows that they already had this whitepaper in January (actually I have seen it even back then but it is way improved now) but coin offering was disrupted by the investigators.

Hater wrote:*"Blockchain systems are tamper-proof ledgers of transactions, and this is essentially guaranteed by the merkle tree roots attached to each block of transactions.*

In a centralised blockchain system, one could argue that the operating entity could simply re-write every single block if they wanted to modify any past transactions. However, this can be easily remediated by anchoring the private blockchain system into another system of higher trust.

This could be a trusted and well-known public blockchain network, or simply a transactional and irreversible information system owned and operated by another reputable counterparty (e.g. a form of git log)."
Not sure what this is supposed to mean, maybe bad paste by topic author but as I see only the first sentence was used and I already expressed my opinion that it is totally ok, so I will let other love it, hate it, or do not care about it :)
Hater wrote:*RE: CoinSafe*
Many members *CoinSafe* 'coins' are still missing since as far back as May *6 months ago!!!

If Onecoin actually had a blockchain (it doesn't) and if user Identities were linked to their coins, than this would be an INSTANT FIX under a centralized system.

*Hunch* is that Onecoin never even backed up their MYSQL servers, and when international Authorities executed a *2-day RAID* on Onecoin HQ January and seized servers, Onecoin permanently lost that data.

So, IMO, for a person who lost, say 1,000 coins (fake, but for the sake of argument) in *CoinSafe*, the company knows not whether they lost 100 or 10,000 because their incompetent scamming asses never backed up the data!

*And THIS is the big Catch-22 and the reason why the company has LOST coins, when they marketed that "unlike bitcoin, in Onecoin which is centralized, it's IMPOSSIBLE to lose coins."*
First of all, you guys/girls need to accept the fact that invetigators from Germany came, took servers, checked your ASSUMPTION of non existing blockchain and they confirmed it is a blockchain. So please stop making clowns out of yourselves with switching to "we can not trust authorities" crap now please.

Second, no one lost anything, I already explained, coinsafe accounts that matured AFTER servers were taken by the police were moved to wrong addresses. Of course there is a log of the amount of coins that were transferred and of course they know where they are.
Coins are "disappearing" even now cause all new coinsafe accounts that mature are also wrongfully transferred so it is not one time issue it is ongoing issue and problem is that IT team that made this coinsafe product slipped a bug and now it needs to be fixed but there is new IT and it is not easy to find bugs in someone else's code.
Why do they wait after split to fix it I have no idea, but when they fix the bug and further coinsafe accounts start transferring to right addresses, they will need to sit and do some physical work of making script that will collect all the affected usernames (this one might even be manually made so it will take time) and just scatter those rogue coins where they belong.

Jtosho
Posts: 68
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:20 am

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Jtosho » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:31 am

Haters words mean nothing to me, Tim Tayshun,Jen McAdam and other haters sit on twitter every single seconds bashing anything onecoin, but this train call THE ONE keep moving, Thanks Igor for taking all the time to put this idoits in their place, not that it will change their low IQ,

Bora
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2018 1:29 pm

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Bora » Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:15 am

Nice done Igor , i appreciate a lot your effort to analyze the post in details and share your thoughts with us , Thank you

Borso
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2018 10:51 am

Re: Whitepaper review

Post by Borso » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:29 pm

Hey Igor

First im no hater

We have al lot of Coins by ourselfs
The Whitepaper is Not the best one but my question is
WHO is the firm in Panama who Wrote this Paper and it Seems like they handle the new ofc .that is a Little Bit Strange...

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