future of One Coin

Here we will post all original accusations and arguments people who hate onecoin wrote all over blogs and comments. We will deeply analyze, dissect and answer everything with objective arguments. People will be left to decide which arguments are more logical and true to them
Igorkrnic
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Igorkrnic » Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:33 pm

CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
So, nobody knows if the claimed 120 million DealShaker coin transfers and all other possible transactions between leaders using fake deals are really in the blockchain or not. And you are saying it doesn't even matter, because the coin is not public.
Ok, that's just great. There's over 30 billion coins created, lots of those in circulation, BUT WHO NEEDS ANY FINAL BLOCKCHAIN BECAUSE THE COIN IS NOT PUBLIC!
Well all is in the blockchain according to what they say. I did not say it is not the final version, I say they can turn off this one and start new one on public. But do not spin my words as I said they will actually do it. For now, we can only follow what they say.
If someone wants to check for tech, go make official demand in your court, go sigh NDA and they will show it to you. This was told to me from the company. So, yes, tech exists. And until public, they are closed source.
Let's see what q1 2018 paper will show.

CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
I can post you Ruja implying that the value is real. Good enough source?
This is what this forum is about. Analyzing actual data, not assumption and opinions. Do it please, let's see her speak. But I will not change my mind, cause it is the truth. This price is not currently credible, but they will go public with it.
If you think of it, any company going IPO with several million users go with stock price $22-$35. Maybe there is a resemblance.

CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
There's no credible one defined price in DealShaker. Everybody knows that. People selling things value the coin very widely depending on personal preference. For some it's not worth almost anything, for some it's close to the announced 15.85€
"Everybody" as your camp?
There are people asking too high price for products. You seem to link that as they do not honor price :) Personal preference.
But I agree there are merchants who ask too many coins which resembles to not honoring price. That number is small.
All stuff that I paid was very accurate.

CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
The price is invented by Ruja&co. There's no clear definition how it's formed. It's just announced. And it's definitely not credible.
And what evidence do you have on Bitcoin price creation? Can you elaborate it? All you will say is "public demand and supply"
There is also a demand for coins and tokens in internal system of this company and there is some math doing that. We do not see it as we do not see coinmarketcap or any exchaneg math and algo.
CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
OneCoin also has no real WhitePaper. You claim OneCoin is and has been in ICO state. Show me another ICO which has been running without White Paper, for 3 fking years.. Closed source/patents doesn't usually mean that nothing is published. OneCoin is again strange, because it published absolutely nothing, and LIED about bought WhitePaper proving current blockchain. But I guess nothing bothers you, not even that the CEO lies.
What is whitepaper? A document with promises. Why is that so important? So investors who participate ICO know what needs to be delivered.
Onecoin is not classic ICO. Coin offering is about to start and there will be whitepaper for that on q1 2018.
As for now, whitepaper are events and presentations done by IMA daily. They explain to people the concept and people can ask them questions.
They did not lie about anything. Where did you see whitepaper published or mentioned by the company officially? It was only mentioned on close leader meeting and hyped by the network.
I told you my opinon. That was only a test to see how community will respond to public tech person. Marcel was eaten with his pants on. Bad idea ;)

CryptoXpose2
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by CryptoXpose2 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:32 pm

Igorkrnic wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:33 pm
CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
I can post you Ruja implying that the value is real. Good enough source?
This is what this forum is about. Analyzing actual data, not assumption and opinions. Do it please, let's see her speak.
Well, here's one source.. if you publish this message.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaV8UueOucs&t=2563
CryptoXpose wrote:
Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:51 pm
The price is invented by Ruja&co. There's no clear definition how it's formed. It's just announced. And it's definitely not credible.
And what evidence do you have on Bitcoin price creation? Can you elaborate it? All you will say is "public demand and supply"
There is also a demand for coins and tokens in internal system of this company and there is some math doing that. We do not see it as we do not see coinmarketcap or any exchaneg math and algo.
There is demand to pay 15.95 euros for the coin in internal system? There is no such demand. The price is not market defined. Nobody gives you 15.95 euros in exchange of 1 OneCoin.
The only currency market there is, is the unofficial Ukrainian OneCoin exchange. They claim to give 0.03 euros from 1 OneCoin.
They did not lie about anything. Where did you see whitepaper published or mentioned by the company officially? It was only mentioned on close leader meeting and hyped by the network.
So you mean it's not a lie, because it was told to leaders behind "closed doors"?? Everybody knew those events are filmed, so proclaiming it there is practically like talking publicly.. Here you can see Wahlroos and Arens claim that the statement from Marcelo's paper describing a "future system" proves that there's a OneCoin blockchain. "Here is the statement, we have a blockchain". Crystal clear lie as text chapter from a "future system" paper in no way proves there's currently a blockchain. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MjkOYszSS4
Well, both have since left the company.

Igorkrnic
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Igorkrnic » Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:28 pm

Seems like forum is unable to exterminate your pestiness with a ban :)
CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:32 pm
Well, here's one source.. if you publish this message.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaV8UueOucs&t=2563
What did you mean to say with that video? That Ruja invents the price? Then you seem to miss how she thanks the team for bringing so many people and she will not extend the split cause so many people want to mine at lower price (we already know what is "mining" at Onecoin, a concept made simple so anyone can do it). So seems like price is driven by people, by demand. It was the same until today. Before doubling on 01.10.2016 price grew much faster, and after doubling, it remained but grew much slower. Now, dealshaker impacts price much.
CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:32 pm
There is a demand to pay 15.95 euros for the coin in internal system? There is no such demand. The price is not market defined. Nobody gives you 15.95 euros in exchange of 1 OneCoin.
The only currency market there is, is the unofficial Ukrainian OneCoin exchange. They claim to give 0.03 euros from 1 OneCoin.
There is a demand that people will give you something else for 1 ONE / 15.85 EUR rate. It is called dealshaker. You are too busy looking at bad deals on dealshaker that you miss out what the people are actually buying for ONE at the rate of 15.95 EUR.
There is no demand that people pay cash for ONE yet. We know it will come Oct 2018.
As for now, demand is made of tokens exchanged into ONE and goods and services exchanged for ONE on dealshaker. This is why the company forbids making fake deals only to transfer ONE from big packs to people who participated. Cause that affects the price and the company does not want fake deals to impact price. I know this for a fact. But no use trying to explain that to you.

CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:32 pm
So you mean it's not a lie, because it was told to leaders behind "closed doors"?? Everybody knew those events are filmed, so proclaiming it there is practically like talking publicly.. Here you can see Wahlroos and Arens claim that the statement from Marcelo's paper describing a "future system" proves that there's a OneCoin blockchain. "Here is the statement, we have a blockchain". Crystal clear lie as text chapter from a "future system" paper in no way proves there's currently a blockchain. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MjkOYszSS4 Well, both have since left the company.
Did you see that whitepaper published on the company website? No, so no need to talk about this anymore.
But I must quote Karis sentence: "here is the proof - we have the blockchain". This was disgusting cause that white paper was not the proof of current blockchain. It was some paper for a future project that apparently never happened. And since Pierre and Kari are not with the company anymore, I would not be surprised that Marcelo was their idea... Made a mess.

CryptoXpose2
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by CryptoXpose2 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:54 pm

I meant to say with the video that Ruja implies the internal value is real. She talks about market capitalization, how to calculate it with OneCoin's (at that moment) current "value" times amount of created coins. She directly compares it to open market based coins, like there's no difference in value forming.

As for DealShaker, value 15.85€ is not consistent, is limited to resticted number of deals. So it's not any generic value. We are talking about coupons here. Not some generic value. Restricted deals and coupons are not something that is consistent and available for everybody (because of restricted amount). They are limited discount coupons in practice. Special cases. Sure there are some deals which can be regarded good, but those are usually very restricted. That's not how real value can be formed. It's the same as with paper coupon; for some time it can give you great discount so the coupon is "valuable", but it doesn't have generic value in long term.

Igorkrnic
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Igorkrnic » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:01 pm

CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:54 pm
I meant to say with the video that Ruja implies the internal value is real. She talks about market capitalization, how to calculate it with OneCoin's (at that moment) current "value" times amount of created coins.
And she was right. Back in 2015 you could really sell and cashout ONE on the internal platform.
CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:54 pm
As for DealShaker, value 15.85€ is not consistent, is limited to resticted number of deals. So it's not any generic value. We are talking about coupons here. Not some generic value. Restricted deals and coupons are not something that is same and available for everybody. They are limited discount coupons in practice. Special cases. Sure there are some deals which can be regarded good, but those are usually very restricted. That's not how real value can be formed. It's the same as with paper coupon; for some time it can give you great discount so the coupon is "valuable", but it doesn't have generic value in long term.
Of course deals are restricted, cause coin is not yet publicly tradable, and I never said dealshaker is liquid totally, but when you buy a coupon, your ONE counts 15.95. I admit there are deals where they put too many coins so when you calculate it based on market value of service or product, ONE value is below 15.95 but that is being dealt with.
I get your point, you stand for open market without limits, but fail to realize that Bitcoin exchanges are open but they have limits too, at least when it comes to selling BTC to FIAT and withdrawals. Those limits are much higher than Onecoin right now.
But I think that will change after Oct 2018. Give it a chance.

CryptoXpose2
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by CryptoXpose2 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:25 pm

Igorkrnic wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:01 pm
CryptoXpose2 wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:54 pm
I meant to say with the video that Ruja implies the internal value is real. She talks about market capitalization, how to calculate it with OneCoin's (at that moment) current "value" times amount of created coins.
And she was right. Back in 2015 you could really sell and cashout ONE on the internal platform.
Maybe some amounts yeah, but it quickly started getting harder and harder. Ruja or the company in no way informed members that the internal value is not credible even when XcoinX was suddenly closed. Ed Ludbrook said it, and instead of that fact being communicated to the members by Ruja and the company, Ed got shit on his shoulders because of what he said. It does not feel honest and fair practice in my opinion.

Igorkrnic
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Igorkrnic » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:44 pm

Correct, that platform was just a test for their public trading although IMA did not seem to realize that since they were pumping people in with promises that they will sell coins there. When too many people were in and too few networkers to buy coins it was no longer viable to hold internal exchange and also dealshaker needed to come in, the internal platform was shut down, it is a good thing, not a bad thing.
And I think it is the main reason for Onelife slowdown and scattering of all those leaders and IMA who did not how to present the idea, they only lured people with fast cash promises.
And yes, although the price is credible on dealshaker, that platform itself is far from final version but they are racing to publish another level.
And ONE will start trading publicly with whatever internal price it has by that time. Will it remain? We shall see. Long time until then.

CryptoXpose wrote: Ed Ludbrook said it, and instead of that fact being communicated to the members by Ruja and the company, Ed got shit on his shoulders because of what he said. It does not feel honest and fair practice in my opinion.
Not sure what you mean by this. If you think he was demoted because of that, no he was not, he failed to launch India and he was no longer needed for training leaders.

CryptoXpose2
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by CryptoXpose2 » Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:51 am

Igorkrnic wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:44 pm
Not sure what you mean by this. If you think he was demoted because of that, no he was not, he failed to launch India and he was no longer needed for training leaders.
No, I mean leaders didn't like that Ed said the value is not credible. Probably Ruja didn't like either, because she never clarified it. The company has never clarified that the coin value is not credible if it's not market tested, even though the company is suppose to educate people about financial information.

Igorkrnic
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Igorkrnic » Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:47 am

I think Ruja never clarified it cause she also thinks so. If she would think it is credible publicly that 2015 talk would continue.
Now it is only on delshaker, and the public is on the way. It is really clear and IMA are doing proper presentations now as you can see selling slowed down. Few people want to wait 1 year to "maybe" be able to profit from coins. Most people want fast money but hell, Onelife at least educates them about the rest of public crypto where instant profit is possible. I wish the crypto community would at least acknowledge that :(

As for leaders bashing Ed, I disagree with them, but I think those are almost all gone from Onelife. If you know what I mean.
If you herd Igor Alberts talk in Lisbon, he said we do not need public trading (as users) we will use coins on dealshaker.

Let the merchants be able to liquidate coins and this is a success. But those who were in here just for money and fast trading are long gone and angry cause they could not trade ONE in July 2016 as projected with old blockchain...
Where are they now... some of them ask me privately in what crypto to invest... Sad.

Affmitt
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Re: future of One Coin

Post by Affmitt » Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:28 pm

Thank you for a very good debate. I really believe in the concept of One coin. About Ruja I agree. There are in fact people that claim she already has left with 0,5 milj. I do not believe it. How could we prove that she is still in her position right now?

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